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Yes

28 (39.4%)

No

43 (60.6%)

Total Members Voted: 40

Voting closed: November 02, 2016, 12:41:30 PM

[Jezza]

As it would be if a vegan billionairre pumped millions into us and got a controlling interest.

It is normal at most clubs that major shareholders are on the board ...

[Ashley Alty]

Hi

As I recall, at the SGM held on the evening of the lost FA appeal against the 18 point deduction in 2006, there was a motion put forward by a Club director that STAR should give all of it's shares to the football club.  Under the then IPS legislation (since the snappily titled, 2014 Co-operative and Community Benefit Societies Act, 2014), now CBS legislation, this was actually an illegal motion as SGMs are called to discuss only the agenda items set out on the Notice calling the meeting but it was rather an emotional meeting and I remember being on my feet for 2 hours answering questions.  the meeting was called to discuss the future of STAR and the large amount of money raised at the Birmingham 20 event which we had just successfully held as a supporters trust which we wanted to target for particular items to help the Club but the club wanted us to hand over without any "strings".  The motion was carried, probably at least a very large majority, we gave up counting, and the shares were therefore given to the Club.  I understand that some of those shares wee subsequently given to Ricky Ponting, the Australian cricketer.  I and the other two remaining directors of STAR resigned from the STAR board and I had nothing further to do with the supporters trust at Altrincham.  The FCA register is here;  https://mutuals.fsa.gov.uk/SocietyDetails.aspx?Number=29532&Suffix=R

I hold shares personally in AFC, as does my husband and we will attend the AGM.  I attend as many matches as I can but won't be making the trips to either Worcester nor Lincoln.

I am still involved with many clubs and am establishing a "Foundation" to get more women at sports events, particularly footie but have to say, I don't think AFC is at all bad at having women fans on our terraces and in our stands, in fact I think we are pretty well represented at Moss Lane  

I am happy to answer any questions about supporters trusts, mutual societies and supporter owned clubs but note that I am currently off work from SD on long term sick leave due to my terminal cancer.

My postcode is WA15

[bumble]

Hi

As I recall, at the SGM held on the evening of the lost FA appeal against the 18 point deduction in 2006, there was a motion put forward by a Club director that STAR should give all of it's shares to the football club.  Under the then IPS legislation (since the snappily titled, 2014 Co-operative and Community Benefit Societies Act, 2014), now CBS legislation, this was actually an illegal motion as SGMs are called to discuss only the agenda items set out on the Notice calling the meeting but it was rather an emotional meeting and I remember being on my feet for 2 hours answering questions.  the meeting was called to discuss the future of STAR and the large amount of money raised at the Birmingham 20 event which we had just successfully held as a supporters trust which we wanted to target for particular items to help the Club but the club wanted us to hand over without any "strings".  The motion was carried, probably at least a very large majority, we gave up counting, and the shares were therefore given to the Club.  I understand that some of those shares wee subsequently given to Ricky Ponting, the Australian cricketer.  I and the other two remaining directors of STAR resigned from the STAR board and I had nothing further to do with the supporters trust at Altrincham.  The FCA register is here;  https://mutuals.fsa.gov.uk/SocietyDetails.aspx?Number=29532&Suffix=R

I hold shares personally in AFC, as does my husband and we will attend the AGM.  I attend as many matches as I can but won't be making the trips to either Worcester nor Lincoln.

I am still involved with many clubs and am establishing a "Foundation" to get more women at sports events, particularly footie but have to say, I don't think AFC is at all bad at having women fans on our terraces and in our stands, in fact I think we are pretty well represented at Moss Lane  

I am happy to answer any questions about supporters trusts, mutual societies and supporter owned clubs but note that I am currently off work from SD on long term sick leave due to my terminal cancer.

My postcode is WA15

If it is illegal, what does that actually mean?

[Ashley Alty]

The law stated that only business listed in the Notice could be dealt with at the meeting.  Therefore no new business could be legally dealt with.  Another meeting should have been called to deal with the issue proposed, however, the mood of the room wasn't such that that would have been a good idea, so the proposal was voted on there and then, which of course, excluded all those STAR members who were not in attendance at the meeting who had had no notice of that proposal and were effectively disenfranchised despite having paid their subs to be a member, which is why that requirement for only the business stated in the Notice is to be transacted is there.

[Paul Cain's Chip Pan]

The law stated that only business listed in the Notice could be dealt with at the meeting.  Therefore no new business could be legally dealt with.  Another meeting should have been called to deal with the issue proposed, however, the mood of the room wasn't such that that would have been a good idea, so the proposal was voted on there and then, which of course, excluded all those STAR members who were not in attendance at the meeting who had had no notice of that proposal and were effectively disenfranchised despite having paid their subs to be a member, which is why that requirement for only the business stated in the Notice is to be transacted is there.

So, really, the vote which took place should have been declared null and void and the process restarted in the correct manner?

[Ashley Alty]

It could have been but at the time, it can't be reversed now, 10 years later!  the shares were properly transferred under the Companies Act requirements, so they are gone.  Only a legal entity can hold shares, that includes an individual person or a legally incorporated organisation such as another company or a mutual society.  The meeting that night clearly wanted the transfer of the shares from the supporters society to the club to happen, probably in an act of defiance of the society board as much alcoholic beverage had been consumed at the time, it was a pretty awful day as the Appeal to the FA against the 18 point deduction had failed which relegated the club at the time - we were saved by the financial collapse of other clubs in the months that followed before the 2007/8 season but we didn't know that at the time of the SGM.

[Paul Cain's Chip Pan]

It could have been but at the time, it can't be reversed now, 10 years later!  the shares were properly transferred under the Companies Act requirements, so they are gone.  Only a legal entity can hold shares, that includes an individual person or a legally incorporated organisation such as another company or a mutual society.  The meeting that night clearly wanted the transfer of the shares from the supporters society to the club to happen, probably in an act of defiance of the society board as much alcoholic beverage had been consumed at the time, it was a pretty awful day as the Appeal to the FA against the 18 point deduction had failed which relegated the club at the time - we were saved by the financial collapse of other clubs in the months that followed before the 2007/8 season but we didn't know that at the time of the SGM.

Sorry, Jacqui. Just to be clear, I wasn't criticising anyone, I was just saying that, in theory, it should have been revisited in the correct manner. It was very naughty what went on by the sound of it.

[GB Alty]

It could have been but at the time, it can't be reversed now, 10 years later!  the shares were properly transferred under the Companies Act requirements, so they are gone.  Only a legal entity can hold shares, that includes an individual person or a legally incorporated organisation such as another company or a mutual society.  The meeting that night clearly wanted the transfer of the shares from the supporters society to the club to happen, probably in an act of defiance of the society board as much alcoholic beverage had been consumed at the time, it was a pretty awful day as the Appeal to the FA against the 18 point deduction had failed which relegated the club at the time - we were saved by the financial collapse of other clubs in the months that followed before the 2007/8 season but we didn't know that at the time of the SGM.

why were shares taken off the supporters trust and then given to an Australian cricketer?

[Ashley Alty]

Understood Paul Cain's Chip Pan, it was a pretty awful night for me I can tell you.  My uncle came over from Liverpool and walked out before the votes and went home, he was disgusted and resigned his membership of the trust, having been an Alty fan for about 70 years at the time.  My friend who also came to give me a bit of support abstained from voting and I was totally exhausted by the end and had to go to the King George for a glass of wine afterwards!  I resigned immediately, of course, as I was obviously not wanted.  I have been an Alty fan, however for 49 years and a season ticket holder, including during my 20 years living in Oxfordshire for over 25 years and a Vice President for about 20 years, so it hasn't put me off being a fan.

It was naughty, you are right, emotions were high, we'd just been, effectively relegated by the FA sand it seemed to the trust members that the organisation they belonged to wasn't giving money to the Club but the aims of a supporters trust were not to just give money to the club without any targeted purpose.  Jenny desperately needed a dishwasher in the bar at the time and we'd done research and asked her what would help her and she was frustrated by the half time rush and lack of clean glasses.  Also, Ian had said that a T shirt printing machine for replica kits in the shop would be a great help to him and we'd found a supplier of second hand machines at a reasonable price.  The money raised and saved from these two projects would have gone straight to the club, it was trust expenditure for club revenue but no-one wanted to listen to that on the night and long term projects were not wanted by the club at the time just a short term cash donation.  So the whole purpose of a supporters trust, what they are and what they do was rejected by Altrincham fans and as an employee of Supporters Direct, it was always quite an embarrassment for me at work but it was a members organisation and if the members did not want it, then it shouldn't exist.  Now it doesn't.

Sausages, that is a question you should put to the club directors of that time.  The shares that STAR owned went back to the football club.  Whether they were the actual STAR shares were given to him isn't definite as the Club may have had some unallocated shares or another shareholder may have transferred some of their shares owned prior to the STAR transfer to the cricketer.  But there was a transfer of some shares to that person sometime shortly after that SGM.  I resigned from the trust board, so the trust's shares were transferred to the club by whoever was the Secretary of the trust with the assistance, presumably of the secretary of the club.

I saw recently that there was a new share offer and that some were unallocated, so there may still be some available for people to buy?

[Jezza]

Didnt know you were so poorly jacqui...wish you lots of love 

[Brian Flynn]

Actually star amassed a few thousand shares

Many of those were sold with proceeds going to the club....as the the then board saw a mass body of fans holding shares as a nuisance and a threat and couldnt understand why the supporters as a body would possibly want more than one share in their beloved football club.

This was sad as the board never saw the advantage of motivated fans feeling part of the club....shares are held by more worthy folk than supporters...these worthy folk dont even turn up for games and probably dont even know our predicament currently...

I did hear that the majority shareholding is now held by the boardroom so de demaunderisation could happen....but why on earth should anyone have a say or gain a shareholding in return for investment??  

I think that you may be right, sir. although I am struggling to remember.I will ask the Forstermeister.

At last published accounts atrincham supporters club ltd held 3752 shares brian.....geoff goodwin didnt understand why we wanted more than one share...he is still listed as owning double the fans holding...

Thanks for that, Mark, not only did I not know that the supporters owned that number of shares, but I didn't know that there was an entity called Altrincham Supporters Club Ltd.

[Ashley Alty]

Thank you Mark, I have survived 2 years so far but currently have just months left which is why I sponsored last Saturday's match.  I promise never to sponsor another match after that dreadful performance 

Brian, the trust's legal name was Altrincham Supporters Limited because the word "trust" could not be used in the legal name as it has as different legal meaning and the word "Limited" had to be used as the liability was limited to £1 per member irrespective of any additional donation

[TheCultOfIanTunnacliffe]

Understood Paul Cain's Chip Pan, it was a pretty awful night for me I can tell you.  My uncle came over from Liverpool and walked out before the votes and went home, he was disgusted and resigned his membership of the trust, having been an Alty fan for about 70 years at the time.  My friend who also came to give me a bit of support abstained from voting and I was totally exhausted by the end and had to go to the King George for a glass of wine afterwards!  I resigned immediately, of course, as I was obviously not wanted.  I have been an Alty fan, however for 49 years and a season ticket holder, including during my 20 years living in Oxfordshire for over 25 years and a Vice President for about 20 years, so it hasn't put me off being a fan.

It was naughty, you are right, emotions were high, we'd just been, effectively relegated by the FA sand it seemed to the trust members that the organisation they belonged to wasn't giving money to the Club but the aims of a supporters trust were not to just give money to the club without any targeted purpose.  Jenny desperately needed a dishwasher in the bar at the time and we'd done research and asked her what would help her and she was frustrated by the half time rush and lack of clean glasses.  Also, Ian had said that a T shirt printing machine for replica kits in the shop would be a great help to him and we'd found a supplier of second hand machines at a reasonable price.  The money raised and saved from these two projects would have gone straight to the club, it was trust expenditure for club revenue but no-one wanted to listen to that on the night and long term projects were not wanted by the club at the time just a short term cash donation.  So the whole purpose of a supporters trust, what they are and what they do was rejected by Altrincham fans and as an employee of Supporters Direct, it was always quite an embarrassment for me at work but it was a members organisation and if the members did not want it, then it shouldn't exist.  Now it doesn't.

Sausages, that is a question you should put to the club directors of that time.  The shares that STAR owned went back to the football club.  Whether they were the actual STAR shares were given to him isn't definite as the Club may have had some unallocated shares or another shareholder may have transferred some of their shares owned prior to the STAR transfer to the cricketer.  But there was a transfer of some shares to that person sometime shortly after that SGM.  I resigned from the trust board, so the trust's shares were transferred to the club by whoever was the Secretary of the trust with the assistance, presumably of the secretary of the club.

I saw recently that there was a new share offer and that some were unallocated, so there may still be some available for people to buy?

I recollect this as being a truly horrendous evening.

Didn't Geoff Goodwin leave the meeting at one point in order to be interviewed live on radio in relation to the James Robinson/18-points deduction fiasco?

In my view, certain board members capitalised on emotions running high in order to achieve their desired aim to eviscerate STAR.  

[Ashley Alty]

Totally agreed, Cult

[Brian Flynn]

Thank you Mark, I have survived 2 years so far but currently have just months left which is why I sponsored last Saturday's match.  I promise never to sponsor another match after that dreadful performance 

Brian, the trust's legal name was Altrincham Supporters Limited because the word "trust" could not be used in the legal name as it has as different legal meaning and the word "Limited" had to be used as the liability was limited to £1 per member irrespective of any additional donation

Thanks Jacqui for clarifying that.