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General Category => Altrincham FC First Team => Topic started by: Alty365 on September 13, 2008, 11:20:51 PM
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I didn't go today so I can't comment directly on our performance. However, here are a few basic facts regarding our current situation:
1. We haven't scored a goal since August 25th. This is simply not good enough.
2. If you discount the opening day win at Woking, we have failed to score away from home at all this season.
3. We have not won in our opening 4 home games.
4. We are barely registering any shots on target, let alone scoring goals.
5. We have reverted back to a fairly negative style of play, despite signing a lot of attacking players in the summer.
6. We have players capable of playing good football and scoring goals but they are not doing either.
7. Our manager has carried on his petulant rowing with opposition fans and general embarrassing behaviour.
8. Being part-time and not having money are no longer excuses for under-performing - Barrow have proven this to be a myth.
9. We are nearly a quarter of the way through the season and we only have 6 points!
10. We have not won in 8 games.
So......
Do we replace the manager?
Do we just accept another 8 months of this sh*t followed by relegation?
Do we hold out some false hope that the pattern of the last 2 years will break itself and we'll suddenly start winning games on a regular basis?
Geoff Goodwin and the board have done great things for this club. Let's be fair, they dragged us out of the sh*t and helped us back to where we are now. They have done countless good deeds for Altrincham F.C. Furthermore, Graham Heathcote did a great job to get us here, sometimes taking unwarranted flak from certain well-known detractors. However, in more recent times the criticism has often been justified and we seem to be stuck in a repetitive cycle of poor league performances and 11th hour reprieves.
Sometimes to break the cycle you have to approach the situation from a new perspective, freshen things up. I believe our board, to a man, is intelligent and strong-minded enough to realise that a change of personnel might just be what the doctor ordered, if they consider the welfare of the club to be more important than that of their good friend the manager.
I understand there are emotional ties, this is a tight-knit club with strong bonds. The bottom line is the club must ALWAYS come first and I would eternally respect the board and manager alike if they took the sensible step while there is still time. Freshen it up, get a new man in and keep this club in the Blue Square Premier - relegation is not an option!
I really am sorry to say this but we are nearly a quarter of the way through the season already and nothing has changed from last year. There comes a time when we have to say enough is enough. Thank you for everything, but please make way for someone else, there is no room for sentiment.
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I didn't go today so I can't comment directly on our performance. However, here are a few basic facts regarding our current situation:
1. We haven't scored a goal since August 25th. This is simply not good enough.
2. If you discount the opening day win at Woking, we have failed to score away from home at all this season.
3. We have not won in our opening 4 home games.
4. We are barely registering any shots on target, let alone scoring goals.
5. We have reverted back to a fairly negative style of play, despite signing a lot of attacking players in the summer.
6. We have players capable of playing good football and scoring goals but they are not doing either.
7. Our manager has carried on his petulant rowing with opposition fans and general embarrassing behaviour.
8. Being part-time and not having money are no longer excuses for under-performing - Barrow have proven this to be a myth.
9. We are nearly a quarter of the way through the season and we only have 6 points!
10. We have not won in 8 games.
So......
Do we replace the manager?
Do we just accept another 8 months of this sh*t followed by relegation?
Do we hold out some false hope that the pattern of the last 2 years will break itself and we'll suddenly start winning games on a regular basis?
Geoff Goodwin and the board have done great things for this club. Let's be fair, they dragged us out of the sh*t and helped us back to where we are now. They have done countless good deeds for Altrincham F.C. Furthermore, Graham Heathcote did a great job to get us here, sometimes taking unwarranted flak from certain well-known detractors. However, in more recent times the criticism has often been justified and we seem to be stuck in a repetitive cycle of poor league performances and 11th hour reprieves.
Sometimes to break the cycle you have to approach the situation from a new perspective, freshen things up. I believe our board, to a man, is intelligent and strong-minded enough to realise that a change of personnel might just be what the doctor ordered, if they consider the welfare of the club to be more important than that of their good friend the manager.
I understand there are emotional ties, this is a tight-knit club with strong bonds. The bottom line is the club must ALWAYS come first and I would eternally respect the board and manager alike if they took the sensible step while there is still time. Freshen it up, get a new man in and keep this club in the Blue Square Premier - relegation is not an option!
I really am sorry to say this but we are nearly a quarter of the way through the season already and nothing has changed from last year. There comes a time when we have to say enough is enough. Thank you for everything, but please make way for someone else, there is no room for sentiment.
spot on
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Excellent post. Have a goodwin
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agree!
Its like groundhog day at Alty and will only end when Graham does the right thing! ::)
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Alty 365. Well said.
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Well said!
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I highly doubt that i will read a better post all season.
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I agree with some of the things you said, BUT:
1. Who would take over for GH
2. If GH is struggling, why would we expect someone new, who might not know the team very well, to fix all this.
As well as this, us not scoring goals is not all Gh's fault. I listened to the Stevenage games on the radio and we had clear chances to score, but we didn't because the player who took the shot scuffed it up. Lastly, stop saying a fresh start. With the few rescources we have, I would be surprised if a new manager would change much because we simply don't have players who can just be switched around and be expected to be better.
If you answer these questions then I will fully agree with you, but until these questions are answered we can't get a new manger.
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the fans at alty have been extremely patient with him,it wouldnt at happen at 99% of other clubs
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IMO whatever happens to alty this season (up or down) theres gonna be some changes in that department anyway, i feel this season is the end of an era
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IMO whatever happens to alty this season (up or down) theres gonna be some changes in that department anyway, i feel this season is the end of an era
Its oly ending because fans who think that they could do a better job than GH are too impatient to see if we can stay up.
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"I listened to the Stevenage games on the radio and we had clear chances to score, but we didn't because the player who took the shot scuffed it up"
That must have been them being polite then because apart from 15 mins at the start of the second half where we managed more than two passes, we were defending constantly.
Stevenage will never have a more routine home win and thats what hurts me. I just wanted to makea fight of it, and say we gave it a damn good go but were beaten by Morrisons class or something.
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That must have been them being polite the because apart from 15 mins at the start of the second half where we managed more than two passes, we were defending constantly.
Your over exagerating, we had at least 2 chances in the middle of the 1st half and 2 more in the first half, if wed taken them it would have been 4-3 to alty
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That must have been them being polite the because apart from 15 mins at the start of the second half where we managed more than two passes, we were defending constantly.
Your over exagerating, we had at least 2 chances in the middle of the 1st half and 2 more in the first half, if wed taken them it would have been 4-3 to alty
Who are you to question what he SAW AT THE GAME, when you only heard a vague description of what happened on the radio?
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you're argument consists on what you have heard on the radio and its against someone who was there?
I think i know who i'm more likely to believe.
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1. Who would take over for GH
Frankly, this well-worn "argument" for keeping GH bores me now.
There are lots of managers who are capable of moving this team forward and getting results. GH is not the great footballing messiah which some people seem to think he is. Try to understand that and then this club might just start to move forward!
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OK believe who you want but this still doesn't change the fact that you want to get rid of the manger without thinking about the quesions I have talked about.
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OK believe who you want but this still doesn't change the fact that you want to get rid of the manger without thinking about the quesions I have talked about.
I couldn't have made a more balanced post at the top of this thread if I tried. You are just a sycophantic Heathcote lover who is putting the needs of one man before the good of the club. You need to seriously ask where your priorities lie.
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I'm not saying GH is the best manager this club has had, I'm saying we need to sort out who could take over and whether, if we change manger this season, the new manager could keep us up this season. I do agree with what you said about the performances and I'm sick of it. But my priorities are that if we do sack GH that we don't end up signing a manger who can't do better than GH this season.
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as i have said alty fans have been unbelieveably patient and it doesnt happen at other clubs
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That must have been them being polite the because apart from 15 mins at the start of the second half where we managed more than two passes, we were defending constantly.
Your over exagerating, we had at least 2 chances in the middle of the 1st half and 2 more in the first half, if wed taken them it would have been 4-3 to alty
4-3 to Alty...are you taking the piss?
Elam went clean through and shot wide, Denham had one saved or blocked at the far end. I can remember no other attacks I am afraid of any note.
Please don't make me relive it!
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I'm tired of people saying I think of GH as the best manager, put pressure on the board, make them sack him. Get a new manager and then we can see if a fresh staert is what we needed.
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If every chance yesterday was put away we may very well have scored 4 but unfortunately if they'd put all their's away they would have had sored 14 - and I was there
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I'm tired of people saying I think of GH as the best manager, put pressure on the board, make them sack him. Get a new manager and then we can see if a fresh staert is what we needed.
You can't live life that way though.
You must make the best decisions you can based on the evidence available. Nobody possesses the ability to see into the future but there is no shortage of capable people who could step in and turn things around. Sticking by a failing manager because the replacement might also fail (always a possibility) would be immeasurably stupid.
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you only have to visit the lewes message board to see how other clubs openly want to sack the manager athough the circumstances there are probably different.
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You might think I was being sarcastic but I was not. I don't think GH cn stay here forever and I think his end MIGHT be near. I just want to make sure we don't be too hasty and end up getting a manger who cannot do any better.
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I just want to make sure we don't be too hasty and end up getting a manger who cannot do any better.
See my previous reply
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"too hasty"
:D
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here's a fact. no manager has retained his job after three successive relegations.
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Has any club who have changed thier manager actually known that the replacement was going to be better? No, but they had the balls to go for it and that's exactly what we should do.
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I just want to know that you know I am asking these questions for a good reason
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Yeah, fair enough I see your point.
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Has any club who have changed thier manager actually known that the replacement was going to be better? No, but they had the balls to go for it and that's exactly what we should do.
Fortune favours the brave! :)
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There is a major chance that any replacement wouldn't be better but when we're in the Conference North having done nothing about it I don't want to be thinking "if only...."
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No matter anyone's opinion of GH, lets face it, he will not be going anytime soon. We should just show him support (whether we feel it is justified or not) and I believe things will get better.
I suspect GG will go at the end of the season and GH will go at the same time. I fear Colin might go at this point too, but I suspect Ken McKenna or GB will take over the manager's job then.
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I suspect GG will go at the end of the season and GH will go at the same time.
IF this is the case (no evidence to suggest either way) there is nothing stopping them leaving right now. No-one is irreplacable and we might as well have a change of personnel while it still matters.
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Lastly, stop saying a fresh start. With the few rescources we have, I would be surprised if a new manager would change much because we simply don't have players who can just be switched around and be expected to be better.
Playing Devils advocate here and getting splinters in my arse by staying firmly on the fence.
Your argument as detailed above is like saying that a Cordon Bleu Chef would be incapable of doing more with a set of ingredients than I would
Differing chefs do different things with the same ingredients and different Managers / Coaches will either use players in a different way or perhaps vary their tactics to arguably suit the qualities and capabilities of the players they have available better.
For example it can be argued that Man City switching Mica Richards from Right Back to Centre Back was a stroke of genius - using players in a different way OR having signed two out and out wingers change the system to play more to feet using quick accurate passing and let the wingers run at opponents rather than a more 'route 1' philosophy
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(http://i109.photobucket.com/albums/n76/altywidow/thumbnail.jpg)
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"No matter anyone's opinion of GH, lets face it, he will not be going anytime soon. We should just show him support (whether we feel it is justified or not) and I believe things will get better."
Don't hold your breath.
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(http://i109.photobucket.com/albums/n76/altywidow/thumbnail.jpg)
That made me chuckle...
simple things, simple minds and all that...
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At the Meet the New Recruits night will the board and GH be answering questions as well as the new players?
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I have a sneaky feeling that Mr Heathcote may call time (or try again at least) on his tenure if we don't get a result against Lewes.
Whether the board accepts it or not is another matter.
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Has any club who have changed thier manager actually known that the replacement was going to be better? No, but they had the balls to go for it and that's exactly what we should do.
Fortune favours the brave! :)
Nothing ventured, nothing gained. >:( >:(
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Perhaps you should count Woking, they're the only bottom ten side we've played (apart from Stevenage, who are clearly in a false position - there' I'm doing it now!). Think about it!
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More crap I spotted in your post, 365. The pattern of the las two years... speaking of which, we had all this crap last season, when we had 3 points from ten before we came good. This season, 9 points (probably) from 10, in the same situation with a lot of new players (and injury trouble). Get a grip son.
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Hugh, when did we 'come good' last season? Seriously.
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More crap I spotted in your post, 365. The pattern of the las two years... speaking of which, we had all this crap last season, when we had 3 points from ten before we came good. This season, 9 points (probably) from 10, in the same situation with a lot of new players (and injury trouble). Get a grip son.
Erm our home record was atrocious up to Christmas last season, awful !! I would hardly say we came 'good'
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More crap I spotted in your post, 365. The pattern of the las two years... speaking of which, we had all this crap last season, when we had 3 points from ten before we came good. This season, 9 points (probably) from 10, in the same situation with a lot of new players (and injury trouble). Get a grip son.
How you, of all people, can accuse me of posting crap I just do not know!
Stickm to arse-licking the man who's all set to take us down for the third year in a row!
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More crap I spotted in your post, 365. The pattern of the las two years... speaking of which, we had all this crap last season, when we had 3 points from ten before we came good. This season, 9 points (probably) from 10, in the same situation with a lot of new players (and injury trouble). Get a grip son.
Why are you assuming we'll beat Lewes?? I don't think we're in any position to be so confident/arrogant as to think it will be so easy!
FFS ::)
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Ultimately, the football for the last 2-3 seasons hasn't been good enough to keep us up on the pitch. Save all the bollocks about running our club properly, I'm talking about using the players you have and MANAGING them, getting them to gel as a team and play good - and if not attractive at least winning - football. We can't even 'win ugly'.
If anyone can name me another club that would accept the performances we have for the last couple of seasons then I'm all ears.
In the end, most managers don't last more than a few years, even when they stay mid-table. We need someone new to come in with fresh ideas and to give the players (apart from Denham, Stu and Robbie) a kick up the arse. Maybe it's all become a bit too comfortable for GH because he knows he isn't going to be sacked.
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I like 365's original post that started this thread, and I totally agree. I am no fan of GH. I posted something some weeks ago and the response I got was a lot of angry fans basically telling me I was stupid for suggesting GH consider stepping down.
This Saturday, against Lewes, I am going to get behind the team 100%, and that includes GH. It would be extremely arrogant of me to just assume Alty will win easily, but I do expect it to be a game where Alty come away with all 3 points in the bag. I hope this is one game where GH will use the 'new' signings properly, get the win, then build on the confidence that the (hopeful) win will give them.
Could this be the game that marks a turn around in fortune?
COME ON ALTY!!
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I like 365's original post that started this thread, and I totally agree. I am no fan of GH. I posted something some weeks ago and the response I got was a lot of angry fans basically telling me I was stupid for suggesting GH consider stepping down.
This Saturday, against Lewes, I am going to get behind the team 100%, and that includes GH. It would be extremely arrogant of me to just assume Alty will win easily, but I do expect it to be a game where Alty come away with all 3 points in the bag. I hope this is one game where GH will use the 'new' signings properly, get the win, then build on the confidence that the (hopeful) win will give them.
Could this be the game that marks a turn around in fortune?
COME ON ALTY!!
NO
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why not?
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why not?
Because Lewes will see this as an opportunity for a rare away win, and will be well up for it.In view of our current form and appaling home record, I think we will struggle against possibly the poorest team in the league. No wins are guaranteed in football, as we all know.
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Dont you worry sweetie Alty will beat Lewes at home EASY and the whole world will be rosy again ;)
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Dont you worry sweetie Alty will beat Lewes at home EASY and the whole world will be rosy again ;)
Certainly hope so.
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The best case scenario is entirely possible.
A lowly Vauxhall Motors in the CSC with the pressure off gives us a confidence boosting win with a couple of overdure goals, in Saturday for once a team that's supposed to be in disarray (Lewes, not us) will actually turn out to be as bad as suggested (instead of turning the corner the week before we play them a la Kiddy, Stevenage) and a 3-0 win eases the pressure.
Bouyed by this we have a go at Mansfield on Tuesday who fail to overcome their travle sickness to date and it's 3 more points setting us up for a good performance (regardless of result) in front of the tv cameras at Rushden.
Thus giving everyone a little bit of breathing space.
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The best case scenario is entirely possible.
The 43 fans who turn up watch as we are completely outclassed tonight. Knocked out of this tinpot cup, Heathcote who spent most of the match arguing with the 4th official over a throw in, hands in his resignation. Matt Le Tissier, who happens to be sat in the stands walks down and takes over as manager, he gets tony yeboah in as his number 2. Both players sensing something needs to be done register themselves. This injection of flare from the legendary players sends shockwaves across conference we go on a 14 match unbeaten run.
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and if this happens could you please pick some lotto number for me
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Not quite sure what a couple of mid table, not good enough for international football ex premier league has beens is really going to do for us.
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Not quite sure what a couple of mid table, not good enough for international football ex premier league has beens is really going to do for us.
He is considered one of the most prominent and prolific goal scorers in Ghanaian and African football history and gained a reputation for scoring high quality goals which often featured in Goal of the Month or Goal of the Season competitions. He was a member of Ghana's national team for ten years, and represented his country at three African Nations Cups during the 1990s. Yeboah scored 26 goals in 59 appearances for Ghana.
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anyway this is going off subject, my love of matt le tissier and tony yeboah is not up for debate here.
my main point.
Would anyone be upset if we lost tonight, especially if the prompted a resignation from cote? either way, it would let us focus on the league rather than pointless county cups.
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Came better then. We had a bit of a run from Droylsden onwards (3-2 with ten men). With injury and other problems before Christmas, our form dipped badly. Then we had a decent run from Northwich away onwards, at which point I hoped we might get well away from trouble. It didn't happen of course, and that loan player being recalled didn't help. Having said that, we're in a better position than at this time last season (I think).
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anyway this is going off subject, my love of matt le tissier and tony yeboah is not up for debate here.
my main point.
Would anyone be upset if we lost tonight, especially if the prompted a resignation from cote? either way, it would let us focus on the league rather than pointless county cups.
I Never thought i'd say this but if Vauxhall win and heathcote sacked i think i'd have a party
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Dear fans, I operate your club in онлайн the manager, I ask you to give me the information on the young players of club, that I could put them in a command(team).
Beforehand to you is grateful.
Александр from Russia
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Dear fans, I operate your club in онлайн the manager, I ask you to give me the information on the young players of club, that I could put them in a command(team).
Beforehand to you is grateful.
Александр from Russia
Young players... well we have Greg.
that is worth a goodwin. god this makes me laugh.
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It might do us good to play a strong team and get a win against Vauxhall. Confidence levels can't be great at the moment. You'd think (though I'm definitely not counting my chickens) that a win tonight and a win against Lewes would do us the world of good.
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Dear fans, I operate your club in онлайн the manager, I ask you to give me the information on the young players of club, that I could put them in a command(team).
Beforehand to you is grateful.
Александр from Russia
We've got a lot on at the moment mate...you couldn't give us a bell back next week could you?
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I'm guessing he want the football manager best team. Dont put him off he could be a russian oligarch with loadsamoney
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Dont put him off he could be a russian oligarch with loadsamoney
More likely a Rusholme Oily Geek with a colostomy.
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Dear fans, I operate your club in онлайн the manager, I ask you to give me the information on the young players of club, that I could put them in a command(team).
Beforehand to you is grateful.
Александр from Russia
We've got a lot on at the moment mate...you couldn't give us a bell back next week could you?
:D
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anyway this is going off subject, my love of matt le tissier and tony yeboah is not up for debate here.
my main point.
Would anyone be upset if we lost tonight, especially if the prompted a resignation from cote? either way, it would let us focus on the league rather than pointless county cups.
I Never thought i'd say this but if Vauxhall win and heathcote sacked i think i'd have a party
yu have said that before though james... ::)