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General Category => Altrincham FC First Team => Topic started by: (S)ALTY on April 06, 2016, 12:11:07 AM
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Despite being stood on the Radio Robins commentary gantry and watching the after match melee after the final whistle me and my fellow match commentators and summarisers failed to notice and report that Marcus's Holness was sent off.
Word has it that after shaking his hand on the pitch and failing to take action on the pitch, tonight's referee informed Jake Molt to tell Marcus Holness who was sat in the dressing room that he had been sent off !
It appears that the decision was taken after protests after the final whistle following protests from the Dover players.
Discuss ...
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If the referee has left the field of play and not told him of his dismissal I fail to see how he could include it in his report.
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Neither Mr Coy or his lineman were even aware of the mêlée when it began - they weren't even looking in that direction, they were over in the corner shaking player's hands. Coy has probably done what he did all night, guess. He is a truly dreadful official, who never ever gets it right. He was abysmal when we played Barnet last season to the point the Barnet manager had to haul his own player off at half time to save the referee from having to do it. He also gave a typically catastrophic performance on tv last Friday, managing to annoy players on both teams. He's not why we lost tonight, but if he thinks some of the challenges that went in on Ranks tonight were lawful, he just needs to quit and take up rugby.
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Marcus cannot have been sent off for the tackle surely............it was 3 feet in front of the liner who did not 'flag'. If the ref thought it was a red, he could have blown his whistle, sent the player off and re-started the game and immediately blown for full time if indeed time was up
During the handbags at the end there were no real reasons to send anyone off from either side.............maybe something was said??
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Until the referees report is known, you are all making assumptions/speculations.
A player can be sent off even if he has already left the field of play or not even entered it. Still the referee would only send a player off, if he had seen the incident himself or on the advice of one of his assistants/Fourth Official.
It reminds me of a local incident down here when the ref turned up and the conversation with one of the players in the changing room before the game went:-
Player - "Not you again. You're the useless b***** who F*** up giving a penalty against me last week"
Ref - "Well you wont have to worry about that this week because you are not playing"
Player - "Yes I am"
Ref - "No you are not, because I am sending off"
Player "You cant do that"
Ref - "Yes I can and I have done - for foul and abusive language to an official"
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I'd be surprised if anyone got sent off for foul and abusive language last night, given one of the Dover players yelled "you c**t" at the linesman for giving us a corner without punishment.
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Gino did something similar to the linesman mid way through the second half. But, the officials last night were so very inconsistent.
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From where I was standing, which admittedly was quite a distance from the corner flag where the incident happened, Holness's tackle looked like a pretty bad one and I was surprised that it went unpunished.
So, to hear that he was sent off after the final whistle does not surprise me, albeit telling Moult to let him know does seem very bizarre.
Hopefully Alty TV will clear this up for us.
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Holness hasn't appeared on the FA suspensions list this morning, all other red cards last night have been added
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Until the referees report is known, you are all making assumptions/speculations.
A player can be sent off even if he has already left the field of play or not even entered it. Still the referee would only send a player off, if he had seen the incident himself or on the advice of one of his assistants/Fourth Official.
It reminds me of a local incident down here when the ref turned up and the conversation with one of the players in the changing room before the game went:-
Player - "Not you again. You're the useless b***** who F*** up giving a penalty against me last week"
Ref - "Well you wont have to worry about that this week because you are not playing"
Player - "Yes I am"
Ref - "No you are not, because I am sending off"
Player "You cant do that"
Ref - "Yes I can and I have done - for foul and abusive language to an official"
Good story
I appreciate players can be sent off at any time...........including subs on the bench before the game starts............my point was; if it was for the challenge, then the ref had the option to send off the player there and then
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Does the ref also have the option to send off at a later time?
Ie - did he think that with all us lot there and a bit of handbags going on, the best way was to get the players off the pitch before dishing out the punishment?
I mean all we'd have done is heckle but he may have viewed it as a flashpoint.
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If only we had a ref on the forum who could advise ..
Sighs
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Does the ref also have the option to send off at a later time?
Ie - did he think that with all us lot there and a bit of handbags going on, the best way was to get the players off the pitch before dishing out the punishment?
I mean all we'd have done is heckle but he may have viewed it as a flashpoint.
If the red card is for foul play the referee is not permitted to restart the match before the card is shown. It is not a foul if the match has ended.
The referee has the power to caution from the moment he enters the field of play, until the moment he leaves the field of play - Law 12.
If the situation has been brought to the referees attention by one of his assistants/4th official after the match has ended, and the player has left the field after the end of the match and the referee feels it is not safe to take action, he would not issue a red card but record the incident in his report for the appropriate FA to take action. I am a qualified referee and as I understand the rules, players have to be notified of cards. A player can dispute any caution when he has not been notified by the referee.
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FA List now updated again, Holness suspended for 3 games, sent off for serious foul play.....
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Serious foul play yet no free kick..
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Does the ref also have the option to send off at a later time?
Ie - did he think that with all us lot there and a bit of handbags going on, the best way was to get the players off the pitch before dishing out the punishment?
I mean all we'd have done is heckle but he may have viewed it as a flashpoint.
Good job the Alty Machete U12's weren't in attendance. Things could have gotten ugly.
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Does the ref also have the option to send off at a later time?
Ie - did he think that with all us lot there and a bit of handbags going on, the best way was to get the players off the pitch before dishing out the punishment?
I mean all we'd have done is heckle but he may have viewed it as a flashpoint.
Good job the Alty Machete U12's weren't in attendance. Things could have gotten ugly.
well that's one thing the junior firm will have no away fans to tell to f**k off next season so they won't bother coming.
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Neither Mr Coy or his lineman were even aware of the mêlée when it began - they weren't even looking in that direction, they were over in the corner shaking player's hands. Coy has probably done what he did all night, guess. He is a truly dreadful official, who never ever gets it right. He was abysmal when we played Barnet last season to the point the Barnet manager had to haul his own player off at half time to save the referee from having to do it. He also gave a typically catastrophic performance on tv last Friday, managing to annoy players on both teams. He's not why we lost tonight, but if he thinks some of the challenges that went in on Ranks tonight were lawful, he just needs to quit and take up rugby.
The worrying thing is Mr Coy must be highly thought of and must be in line for promotion to the Football League, if he was given a big game of Cheltenham v Grimsby to ref at this stage of the season.
He is highly thought of. He was 4th official to Ross Joyce in the Conference Play-off Final last season.
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Serious foul play yet no free kick..
I'm led to believe the match had finished when he floored their player and stamped on him.
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Serious foul play yet no free kick..
I'm led to believe the match had finished when he floored their player and stamped on him.
That was a fin stupid thing to do in our current position, may as well send him back now and save a few quid..
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Must have been frustrated been very good for us to date
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I think we should appeal against the sending off. If the incident has happened before the final whistle I am told the referee must deal with the incident there and then by sending the player off. If it happened after the final whistle then the player can be reported for misconduct. I don't see how a player can be told he is being sent off by another player. I don't think the referee has followed the correct procedure in this incident.
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AltyTV of the incident is out: http://youtu.be/6zsasKwtcXI at 10:00 and then closer at 10:23.
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Should be appealed, the "incident" happened during the game, the lads jumped in on Holness. Infront of the linesman and no where near the ref so how can he decided afterwards to send him off?
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Just seen it on the Alty,it was the very last play of the game so he would have to get send of after the game,if it was a sending off hard to tell Iv only got a small screen.
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Ref looks some distance away and liner did not even flag
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Neither Mr Coy or his lineman were even aware of the mêlée when it began - they weren't even looking in that direction, they were over in the corner shaking player's hands. Coy has probably done what he did all night, guess. He is a truly dreadful official, who never ever gets it right. He was abysmal when we played Barnet last season to the point the Barnet manager had to haul his own player off at half time to save the referee from having to do it. He also gave a typically catastrophic performance on tv last Friday, managing to annoy players on both teams. He's not why we lost tonight, but if he thinks some of the challenges that went in on Ranks tonight were lawful, he just needs to quit and take up rugby.
An excellent & very accurate post....100% agree.
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Looking at the highlights on Alty TV. It is a sending off. It is a bad challenge. But if you mess about in the corner wasting time you invite that challenge. I can't understand why the assistant didn't flag when it is right in front of him. Unless the refs were mic'd up with each other.
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Looking at the highlights on Alty TV. It is a sending off. It is a bad challenge. But if you mess about in the corner wasting time you invite that challenge. I can't understand why the assistant didn't flag when it is right in front of him. Unless the refs were mic'd up with each other.
They seem to mic'd up every time now. And assistants only flag these days if it's something the ref has missed.
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I cannot make out if the referee blew his whistle before or after the incident.
It appears that the Dover player dived into Holness.
It doesn't look like the referee saw the incident as he didn't act, and the assistant seems to react as if the game is over.
As I said before - we will have to see what is in the referee's report. From Alty TV I would think we would appeal.
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Looking at the highlights on Alty TV. It is a sending off. It is a bad challenge. But if you mess about in the corner wasting time you invite that challenge. I can't understand why the assistant didn't flag when it is right in front of him. Unless the refs were
mic'd up with each other.
That looks like a dreadful 'challenge' by Holness and fully deserving of a red card.
Here's a possible answer to your point regarding the assistant referee, as suggested by a friend and fellow Alty supporter:
"The linesman hears the whistle and assumes the ref has blown for the free kick and not full-time so doesn't flag.
The liner is obviously aware of the challenge and informs the ref when they come together."
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Here's another scenario. The 'victim' was in the linesman's ear throughout the entire second half and had a little word with him at the end...just saying like
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Here's another scenario. The 'victim' was in the linesman's ear throughout the entire second half and had a little word with him at the end...just saying like
Also the victim squealing like a pig when he wasn't that badly hurt probably influenced the decision as well.
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Here's another scenario. The 'victim' was in the linesman's ear throughout the entire second half and had a little word with him at the end...just saying like
Also the victim squealing like a pig when he wasn't that badly hurt probably influenced the decision as well.
It looked like it hurt to be fair.
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Clear straight red, move on
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Clear straight red, move on
Agreed.